Not all stools were created equal
There was a comment recently left on this blog posing the question of what makes a good donor for FMT (Fecal Microbiota Transplantation), or a “poop transplant” in plain English.
FMT is actually an approved therapy for Clostridioides difficile infection (CDI). Research has shown FMT to be more effective than the antibiotic vancomycin. To quote from the research, “The infusion of donor feces was significantly more effective for the treatment of recurrent C. difficile infection than the use of vancomycin”.
FMT might not be for discussion at the dinner table, but it is highly effective in some instances.
FMT is actually far more widely used than you might imagine. In one of today’s papers from China they had treated 1,387 people using 20 donors, for a wide variety of conditions.
In the US, autism researchers at Arizona State University showed a benefit that was maintained after a period of two years.
Autism symptoms reduced nearly 50 percent two years after fecal transplant
At two years post-treatment, most of the initial improvements in gut symptoms remained. In addition, parents reported a slow steady reduction of ASD symptoms during treatment and over the next two years. A professional evaluator found a 45% reduction in core ASD symptoms (language, social interaction and behavior) at two years post-treatment compared to before treatment began.
An earlier study with only vancomycin (an antibiotic) had found major temporary improvements in GI and autism symptoms, but the benefits were lost a few weeks after treatment stopped despite use of over-the-counter probiotics.
The obvious question to ask is whether FMT has a potential benefit to people with autism who do not have GI dysfunction. I think this question is far from being answered.
We have seen in earlier posts that modifying the microbiome has great potential to fine-tune the function of the brain. Researchers at UCLA showed that the high fat ketogenic diet controls epileptic seizures not through the action of ketones in the brain, but via the high fat intake changing the mix of bacteria in the gut.
FMT is just one way to modify the microbiome. The UCLA researchers are developing a medical food to produce similar effects on the microbiome as the ketogenic diet.
Very likely a personalized bacteria transfer, customized to the symptoms of the person, might effectively treat many more conditions than just GI problems.
It does look likely that for some conditions there may be super-donors, people whose microbiome is particularly effective, when transferred to others.
But the research cautions against what is called the “One Stool Fits All” Approach. The donor and recipient need to be “compatible”.
The microbial diversity of the donor is a good predictor of FMT success in the recipient. However, donor-recipient compatibility also plays an influential role in determining FMT success. Donor-recipient compatibility can stem from genetic factors such as differences in innate immune responses, or environmental factors including diet, xenobiotic exposure, and microbial interactions.
FMT for Inflammatory Bowel Disease (IBD): The Emergence of the FMT Super-Donor
IBD encompasses both Crohn's disease and ulcerative colitis; two debilitating disorders characterized by chronic relapsing inflammation of the intestinal. In contrast to CDI, there is no evidence that IBD results from an overgrowth of one specific pathogen. Rather, the disease is likely brought on by complex interactions involving the host's genetics, immune system, and gut microbiota. Both Crohn's disease and ulcerative colitis are broadly characterized by a reduced diversity of the gut microbiota with lower relative abundances of the Bacteroidetes and Firmicutes phyla and higher proportions of Proteobacteria. A specific reduction in the abundance of butyrate-producing bacterial species, particularly Faecalibacterium prausnitzii, has been observed for both Crohn's disease and ulcerative colitis. Meanwhile, for Crohn's disease, an increase in a pro-inflammatory form of Escherichia coli has also been reported.
The first successful case report of an FMT for the treatment of IBD was published in 1989 when a male with refractory ulcerative colitis achieved clinical remission for 6 months following a retention enema with healthy donor stool. Subsequently, a large number of FMT studies have been conducted on IBD patients with variable clinical outcomes, remission rates, and longevity of effect. Recently, Paramsothy et al. performed a systematic review and meta-analysis of 53 studies (four RCT, 30 cohort, 19 case studies) of FMT in IBD patients. Avoiding publication bias, their analysis of cohort studies revealed FMT was more effective at inducing remission in Crohn's disease patients when compared to patients with ulcerative colitis (52 vs. 33%, respectively). With regard to ulcerative colitis, a larger number of FMT infusions and a lower gastrointestinal tract administration were associated with improved rates of remission.
In contrast to studies of CDI, FMT studies conducted on IBD patients have frequently identified differential recipient responses that have been associated with variability in the donor stool. Currently, the stool used for FMT is not standardized in terms of donor selection (related vs. unrelated), preparation (fresh vs. frozen, aerobic vs. anaerobic), or the dose that is administered (single vs. multiple doses). While inconsistencies in FMT protocols make it difficult to compare different studies, there is a large degree of variability in clinical responses to FMT between recipients who have been subjected to the same study design. It is unfortunate that information on a recipient's genetic background or dietary intake is not yet routinely assessed, particularly given that some instances of IBD have an underlying genetic component. Due to the lack of genetic information, investigators have instead focused on the donor-dependent effect and proposed the existence of so called super-donors to explain the variation in recipient responses.
The first study to record the super-donor effect was a randomized control trial that was investigating the efficacy of FMT for inducing clinical remission in patients with ulcerative colitis. Moayyedi et al. assigned 75 patients with active disease to weekly enemas containing either fecal material or water (placebo) for a period of 6 weeks. FMT was shown to be superior to the placebo, resulting in significantly higher rates of endoscopic and clinical remission, albeit of modest effect (24 vs. 5%, respectively), after 7 weeks. Of the nine patients who entered remission, seven had received FMT from the same donor. Thus, it was argued that FMT success was donor-dependent.
Currently, it is not possible to predict the clinical efficacy of a donor before FMT in IBD patients. It has been suggested that remission rates could be improved by pooling donor's stool together, limiting the chances a patient will receive only ineffective stool. This stool pooling approach was recently investigated on an Australian cohort of 85 mild to moderate ulcerative colitis patients, in the largest randomized control trial of FMT for IBD to date. Rather than receiving FMT from just one donor, patients in the treatment arm were administered a stool mixture that contained contributions from up to seven different donors with the hope that donor-dependent effects could be homogenized. In addition to this, a far more intensive dosing program was adopted with an initial FMT delivered by colonoscopy that was followed by fecal enemas, five times a week for 8 weeks. Despite the multi-donor and intensive dosing approach, Paramsothy et al. achieved post-FMT remission rates (FMT, 27% vs. placebo, 8%, p = 0.02) that were similar to those reported previously. Notably, however, both clinical and endoscopic remission were required for primary outcome achievement in this study, whereas previous studies have mostly focused on either endoscopic or clinical remission rates alone. The pooled stool mixture was demonstrated to have higher microbial diversity than individual stool alone based on OTU count and phylogenetic diversity measures. Subsequent analysis of the different stool batches discovered that one donor appeared to exhibit a super-donor effect. Specifically, patients that received FMT batches that contained stool from this one donor exhibited a higher remission rate than those whose FMT batches did not include the super-donor (37 vs. 18%, respectively).
FMT for Other Disorders: Is There Also a Super-Donor Effect?
Evidence of FMT super-donors in other disorders outside of IBD is currently lacking. Case series and reports limit the capacity to identify super-donor effects because of limited sample sizes. However, despite the lack of large cohort studies, several studies have hinted at the possibility of a donor-dependent effect on FMT outcome. For example, in a short-term FMT pilot trial on 18 middle-aged men with metabolic syndrome, FMTs from lean donors (allogenic FMT) were found to correspond with a 75% increase in insulin sensitivity and a greater diversity of intestinal bacteria in the recipient compared to autologous FMTs (recipient-derived). It was later noted that the patients who experienced a more robust improvement of insulin sensitivity post-FMT had all been in receipt of the same donor. In a subsequent study on 38 Caucasian men with metabolic syndrome, lean donor FMT also resulted in a significant improvement in peripheral insulin sensitivity at 6 weeks. However, this effect was lost by the 18 week follow up. For the allogenic FMT, 11 lean donors were used, seven of which were used for more than one recipient. Whilst donor-dependent effects were not reported, the authors noted that the “multiple fecal donors might explain the transient and variable effects seen in the allogenic group.” As FMT research in this field progresses from small-scale case series to larger-scale randomized placebo controlled clinical trials, it remains to be seen whether the super-donor phenomenon generalizes to other conditions outside of IBD.
Abandoning the “One Stool Fits All” Approach
Microbial dysbiosis is a blanket term for an unhealthy or imbalanced gut community. As such, the population structure that is considered to represent microbial dysbiosis is variable between different disorders. Moreover, the microbiome deficit of one individual may not necessarily mirror that of another individual and therefore it is not surprising that patients respond differently to FMT. As more FMT-related clinical and microbial data are generated, it is becoming clear that “one stool does not fit all” in the context of treating chronic diseases with microbial dysbiosis. Equally so, the selection of donors based solely on clinical screening guidelines provides no guarantee of FMT success. It appears a patient's response to FMT predominantly depends on the capability of the donor's microbiota to restore the specific metabolic disturbances associated with their particular disease phenotype. If this is true, a donor-recipient matching approach, where a patient is screened to identify the functional perturbations specific to their microbiome, may be the best way forward. The patient could then be matched to a specific FMT donor known to be enriched in taxa associated with the metabolic pathway that needs to be restored. Immune tolerance screening would also be beneficial for reducing the impact of donor-recipient incompatibilities stemming from underlying differences in innate immune responses.
Framework for rational donor selection in fecal microbiota transplant clinical trials
Early clinical successes are driving enthusiasm for fecal microbiota transplantation (FMT), the transfer of healthy gut bacteria through whole stool, as emerging research is linking the microbiome to many different diseases. However, preliminary trials have yielded mixed results and suggest that heterogeneity in donor stool may play a role in patient response. Thus, clinical trials may fail because an ineffective donor was chosen rather than because FMT is not appropriate for the indication. Here, we describe a conceptual framework to guide rational donor selection to increase the likelihood that FMT clinical trials will succeed. We argue that the mechanism by which the microbiome is hypothesized to be associated with a given indication should inform how healthy donors are selected for FMT trials, categorizing these mechanisms into four disease models and presenting associated donor selection strategies. We next walk through examples based on previously published FMT trials and ongoing investigations to illustrate how donor selection might occur in practice. Finally, we show that typical FMT trials are not powered to discover individual taxa mediating patient responses, suggesting that clinicians should develop targeted hypotheses for retrospective analyses and design their clinical trials accordingly. Moving forward, developing and applying novel clinical trial design methodologies like rational donor selection will be necessary to ensure that FMT successfully translates into clinical impact.
Objective: To examine the association between the clinical efficacy of fecal microbiota transplantation (FMT) in recipients and the choice of donor, and to observe the characteristics of intestinal flora and metabolites among different donors.
Methods: A retrospective case-control study was conducted. Donor whose feces was administrated for more than 30 recipients was enrolled. Data of 20 FMT donors and corresponding recipients at Intestinal Microecology Diagnosis and Treatment Center of the Tenth People's Hospital from October 2018 to December 2019 were collected retrospectively.
During follow-up, the efficacy of each recipient 8-week after FMT treatment was recorded and analyzed. Based on the efficacy of each donor, the donors were divided into three groups.Association of the efficacy of each donor group with the morbidity of complications, and association of efficacy of recipients with donors were analyzed. The evaluation indicators of FMT efficacy included objective clinical effectiveness and/or subjective effectiveness. Objective effectiveness indicated clinical cure plus clinical improvement, and subjective effectiveness indicated marked effectiveness plus medium effectiveness through questionnaire during follow-up.
Results: A total of 1387 recipients were treated by 20 donors, including 749 cases of chronic constipation, 141 cases of chronic diarrhea, 107 cases of inflammatory bowel disease (IBD), 121 cases of irritable bowel syndrome (IBS), 83 cases of autism, and 186 cases of other diseases, such as radiation bowel injury, intestinal pseudo-obstruction, paralytic intestinal obstruction, functional bloating and allergic diseases. There were 829 cases, 403 cases, and 155 cases in high efficacy group, moderate efficacy group and low efficacy group respectively. Baseline data among 3 groups were not significantly different (all P> 0.05).
In comparison of bacterial abundance (operational taxonomic unit, OTU) among different effective donor groups, the high efficacy group was the highest (330.68±57.28), the moderate efficacy group was the second (237.79±41.89), and the low efficacy group was the lowest (160.60±49.61), whose difference was statistically significant.
In comparison of butyric acid content among three groups, the high efficacy group had the highest [(59.20±9.00) μmol/g], followed by middle efficacy group [(46.92±9.48) μmol/g], and the low efficacy group had the lowest [(37.23±5.03) μmol/g], whose difference was statistically significant (F=10.383, P=0.001). The differences of acetic acid and propionic acid among three groups were not statistically significant (all P>0.05). A total of 418 cases developed complications (30.1%). Morbidity of complication in low efficacy group, moderate efficacy group and high efficacy group was 40.6% (63/155), 30.0% (121/403) and 28.2% (243/829) respectively, and the difference was statistically significant (χ(2)=9.568, P=0.008). The incidence of diarrhea in low efficacy group, moderate efficacy group and high efficacy group was 7.1% (11/155), 4.0% (16/403) and 2.8% (23/829) respectively, and the difference was statistically significant (χ(2)=7.239, P=0.027). Comparing the incidences of other types of complications, no statistically significant differences were found (all P>0.05). Follow up began 8 weeks after the FMT treatment. The total follow-up rate was 83.6% (1160/1387). The overall effective rate 58.3% (676/1160). Effective rates of various diseases were as follows: chronic constipation 54.3% (328/604), chronic diarrhea 88.5% (115/130), IBD 56.1% (55/98), IBS 55.1% (59/107), autism 61.6% (45/73), and other diseases 50.0% (74/148). Comparing the effective rate of three groups of donors for different diseases, there was no statistically significant difference in chronic diarrhea (P>0.05); there was a positive correlation trend in IBD, IBS and autism, but the differences were not statistically significant (all P>0.05). For chronic constipation and other diseases, high efficacy group had the highest effective rate [65.0% (243/374) and 63.2% (55/87)], followed by moderate efficacy group [49.4% (86/174) and 38.1% (16/42)], and low efficacy group had the lowest [16.1% (9/56) and 15.8% (3/19)], whose differences were significant (all P
In comparison of butyric acid content among three groups, the high efficacy group had the highest [(59.20±9.00) μmol/g], followed by middle efficacy group [(46.92±9.48) μmol/g], and the low efficacy group had the lowest [(37.23±5.03) μmol/g], whose difference was statistically significant (F=10.383, P=0.001). The differences of acetic acid and propionic acid among three groups were not statistically significant (all P>0.05). A total of 418 cases developed complications (30.1%). Morbidity of complication in low efficacy group, moderate efficacy group and high efficacy group was 40.6% (63/155), 30.0% (121/403) and 28.2% (243/829) respectively, and the difference was statistically significant (χ(2)=9.568, P=0.008). The incidence of diarrhea in low efficacy group, moderate efficacy group and high efficacy group was 7.1% (11/155), 4.0% (16/403) and 2.8% (23/829) respectively, and the difference was statistically significant (χ(2)=7.239, P=0.027). Comparing the incidences of other types of complications, no statistically significant differences were found (all P>0.05). Follow up began 8 weeks after the FMT treatment. The total follow-up rate was 83.6% (1160/1387). The overall effective rate 58.3% (676/1160). Effective rates of various diseases were as follows: chronic constipation 54.3% (328/604), chronic diarrhea 88.5% (115/130), IBD 56.1% (55/98), IBS 55.1% (59/107), autism 61.6% (45/73), and other diseases 50.0% (74/148). Comparing the effective rate of three groups of donors for different diseases, there was no statistically significant difference in chronic diarrhea (P>0.05); there was a positive correlation trend in IBD, IBS and autism, but the differences were not statistically significant (all P>0.05). For chronic constipation and other diseases, high efficacy group had the highest effective rate [65.0% (243/374) and 63.2% (55/87)], followed by moderate efficacy group [49.4% (86/174) and 38.1% (16/42)], and low efficacy group had the lowest [16.1% (9/56) and 15.8% (3/19)], whose differences were significant (all P
Conclusions: Different donors have different efficacy in different diseases. Chronic constipation, radiation bowel injury, etc. need to choose donors with high efficacy. IBD, IBS and autism may also be related to the effectiveness of donors, while chronic diarrhea is not associated to the donor. The efficiency of the donor is negatively correlated to the morbidity of complications. The abundance and diversity of intestinal flora and the content of butyric acid may affect the efficacy of the donor.
Conclusion
FMT in practice today does look rather primitive, but seems to be beneficial more than half of the time, even in autism in the Chinese study.
As expected, different donors have different efficacy in different diseases. As FMT becomes more popular you would expect that more super-donors will be stumbled upon and then clinicians will have a better chance to match the donor to the recipient.
For certain GI conditions that do not respond well to current drug therapy, FMT does look a good option to investigate. The level of success is likely to vary depending on the availability and selection of the donor.
It does seem that orally ingested bacteria in the form of probiotics often do not colonize the gut as hoped for, and just past straight through, with only a limited and transient effect. The fact that FMT can have a very long-lasting effect is remarkable and likely due to the fact that these bacteria are direct from another human.
Modifying the microbiome is only now emerging as a treatment idea and it will take many decades to fully develop it.
Ingesting a mix of another human’s bacteria is not without risk.
Massachusetts General Hospital oversaw trial that led to the first death from a fecal transplant, a new paper shows
This spring, a 73-year-old man with a rare blood condition became the first person to die from drug-resistant bacteria found in a fecal transplant. New details about that unprecedented incident emerged on Wednesday.
The man was a participant in a clinical trial run at Massachusetts General Hospital and received fecal transplant capsules made in November with fecal material from one stool donor, according to a paper published Wednesday in the New England Journal of Medicine. Tests after the man’s death revealed that material contained a rare type of E. coli bacteria.
FMT seems to be becoming fashionable, with all kinds of people offering it. The American Journal of Gastroenterology even published a study on Do-it-Yourself FMT. "Almost all indicated that they would perform DIY FMT again, though many would have preferred to have FMT in a clinical setting." I would vote for the clinical setting and a carefully selected/screened donor.
That unanswered question is what we have also been wondering. Not enough money time and manpower goes into FMT research, when so many conditions could benefit greatly: MS, Diabetes, Parkinson, autism, IBS, Crohns. Imagine if all these conditions could be ameliorated to the point of minor nuisance by what is essentially a very cheap therapy. But its, alas, not a patentable pill in a box. We don’t really have GI issues in our child, and we might at some point try FMT if we run out of things to try. Luckily for us in Europe, we have the Taymount office in Bratislava where this can be done for a reasonable price. They do have the ‘one donor fits all’ approach but on the other hand they have been doing this for 20+ years so I think at least serious injury is probably off the table with them.
ReplyDeleteOur daughter is skyrocketing right now - not even the Ragweed allergy is keeping her down, though she is on 2 oral and one nasal antihistamine. The CBD and the QRI laser have worked wonders. A few days ago she explained very nicely that she wants to play with other kids and that ‘its boring on the playground alone’. We literally popped a champagne bottle to celebrate that, and since school is 3 weeks away which in a kids life is 7 eternities away, we booked her into a daycare for school aged kids whose parents work. Sadly, I am unable to attach a photo of her sitting on a picnic blanket with 3 other girls playing with playdough. Its a miracle - like one of those Hollywood success over night stories, a miracle 7 years in the making.
Wonderful tpes! Congratulations!
Delete(I have no idea what a QRI laser does).
/Ling
On the subject of stomach bacteria I recently bought PS128 probiotic from Nauraxpharm, not really seen much effect with my son yet, however its supposed to be kept cool at all times & the enclosed cooling pouches it came with had warmed up, after several days in the post in July, from Italy to the UK. So its either ineffective because it wasnt kept cool enough or just ineffective for my son, i dont know?
ReplyDeleteIts only available in Italy at the moment so no real way round that one.
Has anyone used promethease genetic tool before for autism?
A few interesting things popped up with my son, he had:
rs4307059 that put him 1.42x risk of autism
rs53576 poor empathy
GS290 2 short 5 HTTLPR serotonin transporters, so 5-htp possible thearapy target
rs4654748 poor vitamin b6 concentration, so maybe will try p5p.
celiac & lactose came back clear
Anything else that i should be looking for?
Ross, if the raw data you sent to Promethease is from a company like 23andMe, it comes from a cost-effective technique called Genotyping. This looks for commonly occurring SNPs, it is not meant to find everything relevant to autism.
DeleteFor a medical condition, if you want to be rigorous, you need whole exome sequencing (WES). Some labs do a cut down version that just looks at the genes thought to be most relevant to autism. WES looks at much more data than genotyping and so it costs a great deal more.
A QRI laser is a cold laser with a reflex integration program. Its quite costly and there are probably significantly cheaper cold lasers. I decided to buy this one for 2 reasons: 1. I have 0 knowledge or understanding of the technology and wanted to be sure I was not buying chinese mass made colorful lights but something that is controlled. 2. I have seen this particular laser in action in a therapy office and back then my seriously hyperactive 3 year old sat quietly for an hour while it was being done and she was very interested in it, following as they changed the spots on her body where they put it. The only downside I see is that the people who sell it and make the programs have negative levels of talent to explain what to do with it and how to do it - luckily I had seen it in action and I’m also capable of asking obnoxious questions.
ReplyDeleteI had this procedure at the Taymount Clinic. It helped for about 6 months but I don't think it's a long-term solution. Taymount is good though because they do 10 doses of FMT from 10 different donors, so it's the best place if you are after inoculating your gut with a broad range of species. I'm much more interested in the hygiene hypothesis and evolutionary mismatch theories.. and the associated poor immune function. This is why I'm keen to start on Helminthic therapy, which also appears to modulate gut bacteria and the immune system (TSO (Pig Whipworm) for large bowel, NA (Necator Americanus) for small bowel). I do believe my type of aspergers is inflammatory in nature and certainly not "natural". Some other people's autism seems to be different to this, but I may be wrong. I've also felt like my autism is an imposter that I want rid of.. along with the poor digestion and chronic fatigue which accompanies it. I don't feel my brain is structurally different as they purport all autism to be. Verapamil definitely helps, although I had side effects and I don't believe its the correct approach as I genuinely believe humans have evolved to host helminths, which is why we're experiencing a raft of inflammatory illnesses now.
ReplyDeleteDear Peter, after the skyrocket improvement we had, from Saturday on we have definitive worsening, especially in the attention and receptive speech department. The only thing I can possibly connect it with is maybe that her biggest allergen is currently high. We are giving as much antihistamines as is possible, and I have also brought bumetanide up to 1mg again because of possibly higher levels of chloride due to allergies. Do you have any other ideas? The improvement lasted for more than a month, 3 weeks abroad and 2 weeks here, so it’s not something we imagined or something that was just a momentary thing.
ReplyDeletetpes, if the problem is ragweed/ambrosia allergy you can reduce her exposure to the allergy (stay inside, use an air-filter in her bedroom etc) and alter her drugs. The optimal combination of mast cell stabilizers / antihistamines will vary from person to person. I use dymista/azelastine spray and ceterizine plus a little clemastine. You might also try ketotifen syrup and rupatadine which are also mast cell stabilizers (and also antihistamines), but these take a week or two to take effect.
DeleteYou could consider Pioglitazone, which is researched in autism and should also reduce the effect of allergy. I have used it for a couple of months this allergy season, to reduce our summertime regression.
Increasing bumetanide will take a week or two to show effect.
You might want to keep a diary and record the pollen level and her behavior. In the long term you might consider allergy shots (immunotherapy) as a permanent solution, but it takes time and many injections to complete the therapy.
What do you think about adding Sytrinol as an alternative to Pio? I have it in my ‘to try’ box of meds, so I cna start it today. I am unfamiliar with dosages for autism/allergy for Pio, so advice on that would be good. We already use Azelastin in a spray called Allergol or something like that, and honestly her symptoms ARE a lot better than the years before, but compared to her stellar performance 6 days ago it is very depressing. She has moments during thebday where she resurfaces and that is keeping me from going totally crazy. I will try and change to Zyrtec for a few days. Also, would you recommend to add Quercetin/luteolin/rutin?
Deleteadd on question: you use verapamil, we have the interaction with diflucan to consider. all diflucan would do is raise the efficacy of the verapamil dose. do you think it would make sense to give half a dose od verapamil?
Deleteand the last add on question: pioglitazone in the asd trials was dosed at 30-60mg. in the leaflet of the pills a dose of 15mg is recommended, and a max dose of 45 is noted. why such a high dose for small children and would it affect blood sugar, and how to correct for that?
Deletetpes, Allergodil is Azelastine and Dymista is Azelastine + Fluticasone. For many people with summertime allergy Dymista is much more effective.
DeleteQuercetin is helpful as should be luteolin and rutin. You just have to see what works best for your daughter. I also found Histidine was helpful.
Verapamil is helpful for us when allergy leads to anxiety and then aggression. Other people found further benefits including on reducing the allergy itself.
Surprisingly the addition of a calcium channel blocker can increase the effectiveness of Diflucan/Fluconazole in fighting Candida.
Synergistic Effect of Fluconazole and Calcium Channel Blockers against Resistant Candida albican
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4795682/
I would suggest caution and just try a very small dose of verapamil.
Pioglitazone improves insulin sensitivity in people with poor insulin sensitivity, but that does not mean it will cause low blood sugar in a healthy person.
A pilot dose finding study of pioglitazone in autistic children
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6258310/
A modified dose finding method was used to determine safety and dose response among three dose levels: 0.25 mg/kg, 0.5 mg/kg, and 0.75 mg/kg once daily.
This pilot study aimed to elucidate the maximum tolerated dose, safety, preliminary evidence of efficacy, and appropriate outcome measures in autistic children ages 5–12 years old.
Maximum tolerated dose: there were no serious adverse events (SAEs) and as such the maximum tolerated dose within the range tested was 0.75 mg/Kg once daily.
I choose to use 0.5mg/kg.
Sytrinol works very well for a few days and then the effect is lost. Other people have found the same thing.
I think you have to limit the total number of interventions, otherwise you inevitably will get side effects and interactions.
Thank you for your detailed answers. I will try replaicng aerius with zyrtec first, then after a few days i will try the pio. should it go alongside antihistamines or instead?
Deletetpes, alongside the antihistamines.
DeleteIn the near future, maybe most of the super-donors will not be persons but stool banks like this one below, where human donations could be screened and blended:
ReplyDeletehttps://www.openbiome.org/home
Hello Peter, I hope you're doing well. I trialled pentoxifylline for about a week and I gradually stopped verapamil and low dose clonazepam, I also stopped giving him clemastine because I want to restart later with a lower dose. The first days that I gave him pentoxifylline I gave him 300mg and he stopped repeating frases, his stimming and stereotypy didn't improve, then I read more about pentoxifylline and I didn't know it wasn't recommended to crush the pill because it's extended release would be lost, and there would be side effects so I gave him 200mg divided in 3 doses and there was no effect, I was thinking of giving it time but now I think that stopping the other interventions affected him because I had forgotten about the sleepless nights and they're back, he sits on the bed and talks being asleep or cries, through the day he started to get very emotional or very angry and I see him struggle more to say words. A few days back I noticed dark circles around his eyes and a bit of inflammation, I thought it might be pentoxifylline, also he started to experiment masturbation several times a day, and i didn't know if it was because of it. I stopped giving him pentoxifylline days ago and everything is the same except the inflammation around his eyes, close to the cheekbone and the dark circles didn't completely vanish and he has a redish tone bellow his eyes, I received NAC days ago and I would like to know if he really has oxidative stress and try it again, but I had forgotten that if he has an allergy he may not respond, he also has GI problems again but now it's constipation. So I'm not sure I should go back to the interventions he was on and give him an antihistamine or trial another intervention while he's only on bumetanide.
ReplyDeleteLisa, it is best to make changes slowly, so that you can be relatively sure what intervention has what effect. Keep a diary with your observations and what interventions and dosages are in use.
DeleteWhen you stop an intervention you need to wait a while for his body to readjust, before starting something else.
If bumetanide works then always use it, like your new baseline. If there are GI problems or allergy problems these need to resolved, because they may hide the positive effects of other add-on interventions.
In my son NAC reduces stereotypy from the first pill and then the effect fades away after 3-4 hours. This is not the case with everyone. There are other potential benefits that may take much longer to be apparent.
Lisa, dark circles under the eyes is what I see with my NT kid during pollen season. It sounds allergy-related.
DeleteIn my experience it's never a good idea to start or stop more than one intervention at a time.
/Ling
/Ling
Thank you for responding Peter Ling and Tpes, I will take your advice. These days things were difficult and yesterday I gave him low dose clonazepam again and his mood improved, I give him 20mcg so I thought days back that the dosage wasn't adjusted and that maybe there wasn't an effect but I guess there is.
DeleteThe last time his paediatrician checked him he told me to take him to an allergologist, every winter he gets really sick, and he told me that maybe it was started by an allergy, because of Covid I haven't taken him, I thought that in summer he wouldn't have any problem but I guess I was wrong, and everything seems unpredictable and confusing, he seems sensitive to antihistamines when he never was.
Some time ago I contacted a doctor that prescribes and distributes Transferon (Transfer Factor), he told me that it doesn't work for autism, but I told him I wanted to try anyway, it's affordable but the problem is it's heat sensitive so I think I'll wait until fall or winter, and I have to read more about it.
I want to correct my post in case it's useful for someone, I give my son 10mcg, not 20mcg of clonazepam.
DeleteYep, can second the dark circles and pink upper cheeks as allergy/mast cell issues.
ReplyDeleteI know we all struggle to a small or big extent with the feeling of being alone with our very changed lives with our special kids. And I know we all struggle with the way autism and ither disabilities are being painted rosy pink in the media. I recently discovered the impossibly realistic tv show There she goes. so if it will help to see yourself represented on TV, check it out.
ReplyDeleteNot a lot of new interesting autism research lately, but here is some interesting research on myelination:
ReplyDeletePress Release:
https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2020/08/200824105529.htm
Paper:
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41467-020-17243-z
The research group identified boosting HDAC2 as being important in driving remyelination and found that theophylline boosts the levels of HDAC2 and therefore enhances remyelination with respect to the multiple sclerosis mouse model that was used in this study. Theophylline is found most abundantly in cocoa beans and brewed tea so it might be a supplement to think about with respect to autism and the weak myelination you find in the brain of many people with autism, especially with regards to the corpus callosum.
Smoking and oxidative stress deactivate Hdac2. Low dose theophylline is/was an add on therapy for COPD (severe asthma), but it failed in clinical trial. It looks like low dose theophylline should be trialed in Multiple Sclerosis. Pentoxifylline is used in autism.
DeleteAfter looking at Pentoxifylline briefly, I am not sure how that relates to HDAC2? Also, I have never heard of the drug or why it is used in autism. Could you elaborate?
DeleteTyler, You have natural occurring xanthines such as caffeine, theobromine, theophylline and you have xanthine derivatives like pentoxifylline, Doxofylline etc.
DeleteMany of these drugs are helpful in treating asthma and COPD.
If theophylline activates HDAC2, it would not be surprising if other xanthines have a similar (perhaps weaker) effect.
Pentoxiflline is also a non-specific inhibitor of PDEs.
Recall the asthma drug and now multiple sclerosis target drug Ibudilast is a PDE4 inhibitor.
Not surprisingly Theophylline is also an non-selective PDE inhibitor. This produces some of the side effects that limits its use.
Pentoxifylline was proposed as an autism drug 25 years ago.
https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.1177/088307389601100622?journalCode=jcna
It has been quite widely used. Our reader Maja finds it works well with Bumetanide in her teenage daughter.
Hello Mr. Peter
ReplyDeleteMy name is AEK from Algeria
First, I have sent a message via the Contact Form (named AEK introducing myself, contain information about my daughter case , medication, some references, and important questions )
But now I have additional questions please
1-bumetanide : based on :
Hannaert P, Alvarez-Guerra M, Pirot D, Nazaret C, Garay RP. Rat NKCC2/NKCC1 cotransporter selectivity for loop diuretic drugs. Naunyn Schmiedebergs Arch Pharmacol. 2002;365(3):193-199. doi:10.1007/s00210-001-0521-y
We don't it, but how about piretanide we can order from France , since furosemide can do nothing (I read it can make the situation worse )
2-atorvastatineand verapamil : do you son take them in same day, is there any interactions, even with K supplements
3-verapamil:
Ajima, M.N.O., Pandey, P.K., Kumar, K. et al. Verapamil caused biochemical alteration, DNA damage, and expression of hepatic stress-related gene biomarkers in Nile tilapia, Oreochromis niloticus. Comp Clin Pathol 29, 135–144 (2020). https://doi.org/10.1007/s00580-019-03041-7
Thank you very much
AEK
Bumetanide, Piretanide and Furosemide all block NKCC1 and KCC2.
DeleteWe want to block NKCC1 as much as possible and KCC2 as little as possible (ideally you want to open KCC2, not block it).
It is the net effect of both NKCC1 and KCC2 that determines chloride levels in neurons.
https://europepmc.org/articles/PMC1472095/table/T1/
Of those 3 drugs, Bumetanide is right choice (Azosemide also works, but is hard to get).
All drugs can have side effects in some people.
My son takes the same drugs every day and most of them for several years now, with no harmful side effects.
Autism requires personalized therapy and so what works for one person may not work in another person and may even make their autism worse. You have to go step by step seeing if your daughter is a responder to each potential therapy. Try new therapies one at a time, not all at once.
Dr Adams recent FMT post.
ReplyDeletehttps://youtu.be/vawc1tbXNgs
Stephen
Hi Stephen, The MTT results are interesting and the presentation mentions a Phase 3 for FDA approval but can't find the Phase 3 study. Do you know if there is any off label prescription for Vancomycin + MTT by any of the well known MAPS doctors in US?
DeleteHi Peter,
ReplyDeleteI know some of your readers use Vancomycin daily so I thought this would be a good article for them to read.
Vancomycin Pretreatment on MPTP-Induced Parkinson’s Disease Mice Exerts Neuroprotection by Suppressing Inflammation Both in Brain and Gut
https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s11481-021-10047-y